I know this has been asked before, but I am still know closer to finding the answer.
Is it illegal to put peoples songs in your films if you dont make a profit off the film?

I'm not an expert, but based on what I have read on various filmmaking boards - regardless of whether you are making a profit or not, without the proper permission - there would be the chance of being sued if you used someone else's work in your film.

That goes for music or any other copyrighted images (such as a TV show broadcasting in the background - like SURVIVOR, FRIENDS, etc.).

I think there are various 'rights' you can get for copyrighted music (anyone feel free to correct me if I am wrong or misleading):

1. Music rights to use in your film - meaning you would pay royalties and you could use the song.

2. Music rights to duplicate - meaning a garage band covers that song or someone in the movie is sings that song. (Even HAPPY BIRTHDAY is copyrighted and must be cleared - that's why you have some films sing FOR HE'S THE JOLLY GOOD FELLOW at birthday parties - it's public domain).

3. Festival rights. Much cheaper and in some cases, free. But, if the film is ever shown outside of festival - regardless of making profits - you need the regular music rights - and once you need them at that point, I would think there is LESS negotiating as no one wants to re-edit and the music industry will know that.

4. Just because you know the singer/songwriter, you can't just get their permission. You would also need waivers/clearance from the record label also (not very likely!).

I've been told and it has been suggested that you should never have your heart set on a particular piece of music that 'fits your film perfectly', as the chances of getting several thousand dollars for rights is minimal. Either search the public domain (not sure how - someone help here!) for songs that can be used or find local musicians that would write original music for free (for placing in the credits). When I did my short, I had three separate musicians want to do the music for free. It isn't a known piece, but the music is good.

There are also those royalty-free CDs, and the music is quite good, but those tunes are available to anyone and I personally would rather have someone write new music, specifically for my film.

That's the extent of what I've read and remembered, so if anyone can add or correct anything above, please do so.

Sorry it was so lengthy and good luck.

Mark M
Scooter Productions

The general concensis is, if your a film student, competing in student competitions, no one cares. Your just to small a fish to worry about. What are they gonna sue for? Your tuition? They have to prove that you cost them money by using their music. They could get a cease and desist order, but that would be unlikley. Now, if you were to start competing in say, proffessional level film festivals, that is when it would be an issue.
Recentley, one of the top rated short films on www.triggerstreet.com was dropped from the site. The reason? They didnt hold the rights to the music used in the short. They plan on exhibiting, and possibly, making money off of, several of the top rated shorts. No music rights, no can do. If you can get the rigfhts to some music, and it works for what you want to do, then go fo it. But if some other music makes the piece better, use that. I a very musically driven in my film making, and editing. I like to have the music first, and cut around it. Its more important to me to have good music, then rights. Soon however, I will be making a short for proffessional competition, and I need original music for that. My idea is, I will cut to pre existing soundtracks, and then, the composer will create original music, with the same pacing. I hope this helps you in some way. Best of luck.
R. Michael McWhorter

And you shall know us by the trail of dead.

and no I'm not talking about droped food. Cant' you use a song for a maximum time of like 10 seconds, then you have to pay for the rights? I used songs like the ROCKY theme song, the MI theme, and celebrate good times before for under like 15 seconds, does anyone know if that would be fine?

if the music, or any other intellectual property, is recognizable, you need permission from the owner. The music can be less than a second and as long as some overpaid media lawyer can hire an even more overpaid expert to say that it is someone's intellectual property, it's illegal.

Now, how closely is this followed? Not very, in most cases (just look at studentfilms.com). I've worked at a local production house and they use music without permission in television commercials all the time. But I guarantee you that when you try to get a job where you create your own intellectual property, if you're known for steeling people's work, you won't get hired. If you take a film to any respectable festival without at least securing festival rights to music, you're asking to tear tickets and serve popcorn in your chosen industry. It sucks, but these rules will protect your work some day.
joren

I actually just found a website for the very purpose of allowing anyone to commission high-quality music composition, to their specifications, for any project they have in mind. It is here:

http://notyetmusic.weebly.com

It seems like it could definitely pay off, both creatively and financially, to commission music instead of paying a licensing company; here’s a site where you can get a direct connection with the artist who wrote the song in your movie, because he wrote it for the movie. Thoughts?

Thanks,
-PhD